| RDAvena |
Posted
Tuesday, Sep 30th 3:08am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 154
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
It has been a while since I upgraded my front brakes to the '84 volvo 240 turbo 4 piston calipers. I just thought to make a write up for those interested along with some pics. For this conversion you will need to change your wheel size since the calipers will not fit with a 13 inch wheel(unless they are the steelies). Another part of the conversion is to switch to a Master cylinder from an e12 530i with the four front ports so as to run dual lines to the two front calipers. Also an extra set of e21 front lines will be needed along with the flex lines. Here is a pic of the two front stainless flex lines.
You can opt to "t" off the single line to the caliper. Not sure what the ill effects are. Some have said that the full function of the brakes is not felt from the stock master cylinder and the T'ed off lines. With changing the master cylinder out to the e12 model you will also increase the diameter of the cylinder to 23mm from 21mm.
Here is a pic of the Volvo Caliper mounting points
volvocaliper.jpg"> volvocaliper.jpg" BORDER=0>
A test fit of thelines to the caliper on the strut assembly
Here is a test fit of the caliper after trimming the rear shroud. A small bit of trimming is needed in order to fit the calipers in place.
What is the big deal of "upgrading" the brakes to the volvo four pistons? You will increase the pad area of the brakes for one. And for others it will upgrade the stock solid discs to the vented types. You will need vented discs from a 1977 320i or any year 323i for this upgrade. Here is a pic of the differences in the pads. The small pads are the "baby" pads for the rear calipers. I will change these out to the spare calipers and pads left over on the 535i once I convert those rear brakes to the e34 M5 types.
The pads if you opt not to drill out the caliper mounting holes will ride high on the disc by like 2to 3 mm. You can machine out the upper parts of the caliper and make it seat all the way until the rotor grinds a bit on the middle spacer. You can machine this by 1.5mm and it will stop grinding. An added note is to place a 1mm washer between the caliper and the strut assy so that the caliper centers itself on the rotor and both pads wear evenly. Braking is much improved over the old calipers and the pedal feel is firm. I purchased the calipers from a junkyard and rebuilt them. You can go about it the lazy(easy) way and trade them in as cores for a rebuilt set from the CHecker/Shucks/Kragen store and get a pair of reman calipers for 60.00. They charge 40.00 for the cores. Also some caliperscame in aluminum and there may be a weight savings with that. Not sure how it will handle the heat. |
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| jbob |
Posted
Tuesday, Sep 30th 10:12pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 52
AZ, USA
81 320i |
awesome write up ray! 
so in order to seat the whole pad on the rotor faces, u need to machine out the caliper mounting holes in the caliper? or in that lower strut assembly?
also, do u know of any places (checkers?) that sell rebuild kits for the volvo calipers?
can't wait to get mine on and done! |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Tuesday, Sep 30th 11:04pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 155
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
The calipers themselves. It is roughly 3mm worth of machining on the upper part of the hole so that the caliper seats straight down. After torquing the mounting nuts it will not move. For added security you can back fill the rest of the hole by welding it. Or fill it with weld then machine the hole where it needs to be. EAS has the best price that I have found for the rebuild kits so far.
http://catalog.eautopartscatalog.com/eas/quote.jsp?partner=eas&year=1984&product=N1050-18936&application=000159990&clientid=europeanautomotive.com&cookieid=11T0OA428&baseurl=http://www.europeanautomotive.com/ |
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| jbob |
Posted
Tuesday, Sep 30th 11:51pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 53
AZ, USA
81 320i |
awesome, thanks for the clarification and the link!
what brand brake pads are u using? |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Wednesday, Oct 1st 12:16am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 156
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
I am going to try out the PBR deluxe pads(Metal Masters?) since I really do not track the car as much. These pads should give a little more bite at the expense of the rotors it has now. I ran the Jurids all last year and did not have issues with fade or excessive wear on the rotors. The pads are a lot cheaper than the BMW types as well. I figure I can run these pads on what is left of the rotors and swap in new rotors and pads next year. EAS also has real good prices on vented rotors. |
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| jbob |
Posted
Wednesday, Oct 1st 12:44am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 54
AZ, USA
81 320i |
cool, yeah i have the pbr deluxe in the front right now...i love that they don't dust as much & the dust it does leave is this light tan color (pretty much looks like dirt) & brushes away easily. |
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| melloh |
Posted
Wednesday, Oct 1st 6:24am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 93
California, USA (San Jose)
1980 320is, 1991 318is |
When I mentioned the volvo caliper swap to my mechanic, he cut me off w/ a hefty "no! never use anything not made for a bmw" He didnt explain much further, I didn't ask. I'll stick to hunting down some rotors for the vented discs - should still be more than enough for my stock 320. Oh well. This is definitely the most thorough literature I've seen on the conversion though. Too bad I'll never get to use it  |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Wednesday, Oct 1st 6:54am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 157
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
Progress or advances in technology is/are never made by not thinking outside of "the box". Not knocking your mechanic as I am sure he may have his/her reasons to say "only BMW parts on a BMW".
But if these brakes can slow down a 240turbo Volvo sedan/Station Wagon/touring/whatever weighing in at over 3000lbs I am sure they might work in a semi decent fashion on a measly 2000+lb car. Even if they are English made brakes...
I am not trying to rewrite the BlueBook just offering an alternative to $1200 "kits" with a lower budget fix that works just as good if not better. |
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| melloh |
Posted
Thursday, Oct 2nd 9:22am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 94
California, USA (San Jose)
1980 320is, 1991 318is |
Agreed! But, as along as he's my mechanic, they wont be going on my car... wouldnt wanna piss off or insult the guy i entrust my car's longevity to, right? Plus, i'm partially using this as an excuse not to prevent more unnecessary money-burning. Like I really 'needed' the bilstein/H&R suspension, front/rear tower, a full tune-up every year, the alpinas i bought from germany but never received, or battery relocation. Anyway, you get my drift (drifting is fun too) - absolutely no harm was intended by my comment as I was merely babbling as usual.
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| aussie323i |
Posted
Monday, Oct 6th 3:53pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 16
australia
1979 323i |
Just wondering if there's anything special about the 240 turbo calipers, or will the 4spot calipers off a 244 or 264 be suitable as these are readily available at my local wreckers. One of the 244's from the 80's there had alluminium callipers.
Cheers |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Monday, Oct 6th 5:08pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 163
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
Nothing special, they are all the same calipers. Just make sure you get them from an 83 to 86 Volvo 2** in any configuration(turbo, wagon, sedan, ect). The aluminum calipers are easier to machine but are harder(more expensive) to weld back in. Of course they will relieve some unsprung weight but not sure by how much. Polishing instead of painting them will make them look pretty. Alu calipers have been known to flex on their mounting points during braking. Not sure how much flex these might have. |
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| jbob |
Posted
Wednesday, Oct 8th 9:24am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 64
AZ, USA
81 320i |
weeee......got my rotors!!
and the rest of the brake upgrade is itching to be installed
damm, need to get some bigger wheels tho |
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| aussie323i |
Posted
Thursday, Oct 9th 1:12pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 17
australia
1979 323i |
thanks for the info... will probably scour the wreckers for some this weekend. My car has 14 inch mags on it... will the calipers fit, or are 15's required? |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Thursday, Oct 9th 6:54pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 167
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
They will fit behind the 14s. I had them behind 14 inch Exims before I put the Alpina wheels on the car..
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| M42powered |
Posted
Thursday, Oct 9th 7:19pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 174
Arizona, USA
1981 BMW 320i |
Damn it... everyone is jumping on this one. I'm just going to have to do wilwood's to stay above the curve  |
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| jesse |
Posted
Tuesday, Oct 14th 12:29am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 27
SF, USA
Dinan 1978 333i, honda insight, audi S4 |
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=33563&item=2437035251
edit: thanks to user error this became a new post instead of a reply to the volvo brake caliper upgrade post
edited by Tricord: moved back to where it was intended...
no affiliation to the seller |
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| jesse |
Posted
Tuesday, Oct 14th 12:33am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 28
SF, USA
Dinan 1978 333i, honda insight, audi S4 |
which wilwoods would you use? i have a pair of 4 piston calipers that i want to install on my 320i, but it already has 4 piston front calipers. I think i'm still going to do it because i believe the wilwoods will be much ligheter.
FWIW, i looked at all my calipers, i have 4 piston in front and 2 piston in rear. i rode my bicycle past a 633 for sale and stopped to check out the brakes, they *looked* identical to mine. So i'm wondering if that isn't a potential upgrade for us e21 320i'ers also or if mine has some custom fabrication on it. |
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| redmist |
Posted
Tuesday, Oct 21st 9:28pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 5
NY USA
357i , 325i e30 turbo |
There is a brand new Volvo 240 vented disk caliper on EBAY for $24.99.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&category=33563&item=2437690432 |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Tuesday, Oct 21st 9:32pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 179
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
Not dissing your find but for 6.00 more you can replace cores out of the junk yard with remanufactured units from Checkers auto parts stores. They charge 90.00 for the calipers outright and 60.00 for the core. Pull a set out of the Jyard for 15.00 each and trade them in for the rebuilt units. |
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| redmist |
Posted
Wednesday, Oct 22nd 3:36am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 7
NY USA
357i , 325i e30 turbo |
Don't quite understand your point.
The caliper on EBAY is NEW with no core deposit for $24.99.
Are you saying it is better/cheaper to get a junkyard core for a junkyard for $???? and send it $??? to a rebuilder or as a core deposit on a new caliper. |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Wednesday, Oct 22nd 5:37am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 181
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
The point is:
if it was a buy it now for 24.00(it is not), then yes it is a deal but you are still missing one caliper. Where the pair would be 15.00 more or less at the Jyard and after turning them in for cores 60.00 would still get you two new calipers. You are out what, 75.00, for two new calipers? This is turning in the junk(used) calipers for new(remanufactured)calipers off the counter in their box. Not having them rebuilt buy Joe's Brake Service Shop.
Like I said before you are still mi$$ing another caliper.Here is the price of your mising left side caliper.
http://catalog.eautopartscatalog.com/eas/quote.jsp?partner=eas&year=1984&product=N1040-20815&application=000160157&clientid=europeanautomotive.com&cookieid=1170YV72D&baseurl=http://www.europeanautomotive.com/
Still have a 35.00 core charge here as well.
And this is from the cheapest online parts source. It ends up a little more expensive than the other way, no?
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| Matt |
Posted
Wednesday, Oct 22nd 10:24am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 198
SF Bay Area
81 320i |
Look, bottom line:
RDAVENA:
This way is more time consuming (because of the junkyard run) but is about $30 cheaper
REDMIST:
Your way is easier but costs more and is risky (ebay)
The best way would be to just bite the bullet and oreder the two calipers NEW from EAS along with some new vented rotors and whatever pads you want to fit the new calipers. You might even get free shipping  OMG you might spend an extra $30, that could get you like 15 HOT POCKETS, MMMMMMMMMMM hhhoooootttt pppppooooccckkkkeeeettttsss aaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh  |
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| redmist |
Posted
Thursday, Oct 23rd 12:37am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 9
NY USA
357i , 325i e30 turbo |
I bought two new calipers for $115 delivered with no core charge from a nice gentleman in Canada.(negotiated a post ebay auction that didn't meet the reserve price) The caliper on EBAY went for 25.49. Point is if you are patient deals can be had. |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Thursday, Oct 23rd 1:14am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 183
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
I still disagree. New reman calipers 35.99 each at Checkers(Kragen, ect) after turning in the old ones(10to15 dollars) no shipping charges, face to face contact.
Point was patience, but a little extra leg work(persistence) pays higher dividends. |
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| redmist |
Posted
Friday, Oct 24th 4:36am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 13
NY USA
357i , 325i e30 turbo |
Question. Do these calipers come in an aluminium casting? thanks |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Friday, Oct 24th 7:09am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 187
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
Yes they do. Some have said they can "flex" on their mounting points though. Not sure how valid that claim is. |
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| redmist |
Posted
Sunday, Nov 30th 11:40pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 80
NY USA
357i , 325i e30 turbo |
Just some additional details from doing this myself today...
The backing plates just need the corners trimmed very very slightly.
Regular grade 8 7/16" washers between the caliper and the spindle center the caliper perfectly.
In order to get the brake pad completely on the caliper use a die grinder to elongate the holes by grinding inward until the raised portion of the mounting hole is gone.
I back welded the holes. As the calipers are cast iron you should heat the outer edge of the holes first with a torch before welding (be careful of the seals!).
Also there is a metric bubble flair tee available
which eliminates a the need for any further adapters. It is available here
http://www.racecarsupply.com/html/wheels.html part # CNC 883. They also made up the brake lines for me. Nice folks. |
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| RDAvena |
Posted
Tuesday, Dec 2nd 8:47pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Staff
Post nr. 260
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
1981 323i, 1988 545is, 1997 528i |
good stuff. Nice to have other ppls experience noted. Hope they do well for you. |
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| redmist |
Posted
Sunday, Dec 7th 10:09pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 88
NY USA
357i , 325i e30 turbo |
One last thing. I found that the 320 master cylinder was absolutely fine for the conversion. Pedal is nice and high and firm. |
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| JJG323 |
Posted
Tuesday, Aug 3rd 1:44pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 144
Reading MA USA
1979 BMW 323i |
excellent stuff Ray, Redmist and everyone. I have the new calipers here.
For anyone who needs an extra core set to be sent back to get the rebuilt ones I have them as well.
I got my new set of ebay. They where billed as Hartge calipers, and they are a far cry from that. Oh well, I cant wait to put them on my 323i. Maybe someday Wilwoods or AP on the fronts.
I talked to Matt Shaw. He also showed me that its
possible to have coleman racing make you or anyone a set of LARGER front two piece custom rotors. I just dont know how much bigger my 15 x 6.5 BBS rims will take.
thanks
Joe |
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