| docctorwho |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 7:56pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 1
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
Ok i got this 1983 320i m10 e21 from my brother!!!
he had replaced the head on it an in doing so removed alot of the cars wireing and ect. After a couple of weeks o finally realized that the starter was wired wrong. so now i got it to turn over. but i have no spark. Ive swapped out the ICU and still the same problem. Also i think this is odd... I have battery voltage on both terminal 15, and terminal 1 of the coil. when i pull the green wire off terimnal 15 of the coil terminal 1 voltage drops to 0.1VDC Green wire stayes at batt. voltage. Alt. is hooked up correctly, charge light functional. Im really not fimilular with BMW... Can you all help me trouble shoot this... The car ran before he changed the head. Now i cant get a spark. please advise!!!
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| myersport |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 8:59pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
Be sure the pickup lead at your distributor is plugged in. It's a large green wire with a 2 pin black plug. Also, be sure that the connector at the ignitor is fully seated. The ignitor is on the driver side ahead of the firewall, a 5 or 6 pin plug, has a rubber boot covering the whole thing. Not sure if this is the same component you refer to as the ICU, or if you were referring to the ECU in the glove box.
Also, standing 12 volts on both terminals of the coil with key on and engine off is normal. The ignitor grounds the circuit from terminal 1 of the coil to fire the coil based on position signals from the trigger in the distributor.
--Dennis |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 9:17pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 3
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
indeed the ignitor i did refer to as the ICU located driverside corner oppsite the batt. Mounted in a plate covered by a rubber boot. has 6 terminals. Quick question!! You said that the ignitor or ICU as i called it lol...was controled by the distributor if the distributor was off a tooth or so would this effect the ignitor fireing? if so what is the best way to test this? also im working on this veihicle right now so any helpful leads would be great... The plug in the side of the distributer is snug...also just tested the load voltage on term 1 of the coil the VDC drops to 9VDC when turning over the engin but holds to around 9V if i hook up a test light do i ground the light and hot the tetminal 1? Anyone feel free to jump in lol also can anyone tell me what the 2 relay/mods do that are mounted to the firewall and could they play a part in this???
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| myersport |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 10:24pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
The ignitor will still fire the coil if the dizzy is off a tooth. It doesn't know or care where you have the timing set. The pickup under the cap sees one of four teeth pass by it and the ignitor grounds pin 1 of the coil, collapsing the field and causing the spark. If the coil has voltage, and the ignitor is live, you should have spark.
Ignitor pinout:
Term 15: B+
Term 16: Ignition pulse to coil
Term 31: Ground
Term 7: to dizzy pickup(trigger input)
Term 3: to dizzy pickup
Term 31d: Shield for trigger input
If all these inputs check out, you either have a bad coil, 2 bad ignitors (unlikely), a bad pickup in the dizzy, or a secondary ingition proble, i.e. the coil wire or cap/rotor assembly.
This is a pretty simple system, and you should be able to figure the problem out fairly quickly.
--Dennis |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 10:42pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 5
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ok dennis... Thank you again for your help. I checked the leads from and to the ignitor... All of them lead to the right spot. Voltage appears to be normal on all pins, including earthed pins. So this leads me to the coil. I have another coil i put on the car and still had the same problem of no spark. Maybe i am tasting the coil pulse wrong. I have a grounded spark plug clicked in to the coil via a a plug wire still no spark. Is there a way to check the coil better then this? I can change parts but the electroinc baffel me!!! you help in this is much apprishiated!!! the dizzy isn't even connected to the coil? should it be to get a spark? I didn't think it mattered!
Docc |
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| myersport |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 10:52pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
The traditional test is to use one of the spark plug wires from the dist cap. Just remove the plug end from the spark plug and insert a known good plug, and be SURE the electrode is grounded against the engine block, and have an assistant crank the engine. You should get a strong blue spark. This method tests all of the secondary ignition components, not just the coil
Good luck!!
--Dennis |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 11:14pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 7
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
 ok ill give it a try be back in a second with test results. but i fear that if im not getting spark this way i wont get a spark at all. However im not good with this kinda thing and am willing to try anything you might suggest. |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 11:22pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 8
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ok this worked on all four points of the dizzy. Spark was not spactular but was there. so i guess this is a simple timing problem??? |
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| myersport |
Posted
Tuesday, Jun 5th 11:43pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
Very well could be. Line up your OT (top dead center) mark on your crank pulley with the marker on the timing cover, and take the cap off the dizzy. There is a mark on the dizzy lip ( you might have to take off the black dust cover) that should line up with the tip of the rotor. If it is WAY off( about 180 deg), turn the engine over one more time and relign the marks up. Set the the dizzy up so that the rotor tip lines up with the mark. If there is not enough adjustment, you may be off a tooth or two. R&I the dizzy to line up the marks. This will give you the base setting, and you an set the timing from there with a timing light, but at least it will fire upand run.
--Dennis |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 12:05am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 9
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ok dennis im sure this is a novice question but how do i get the TDC mark(Balencer Pully) to line up to the timing cover mark. turning the key over shoots it every time?
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| myersport |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 12:06am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
30mm Socket and ratchet. |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 12:08am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 10
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ahhh makes since duh
TY
I did get it to backfire though!!!
I have 2 marks which one is it the first or second!!! |
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| myersport |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 12:12am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
One is marked Z, which is the firing mark. The other is markd OT whis TDC. It should be the second mark, turning the engine clockwise.
--Dennis
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 12:13am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 11
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ok then going to check timing marks
TY
Docc |
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| myersport |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 12:17am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
I checked a spare that I have, and it only has 1 mark, stamped OT on the bell portion between the belts and the engine cover.
--Dennis |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 12:20am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 12
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ok i have run into a snagg i have no 30mm. So ill have to quit for the night. But i did notice something, my dizzy is free to turn all the way around. The outside that is. Is this normal??? |
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| myersport |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 12:36am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
Not with the vacuum line and trigger wire plugged in!!!
Otherwise, it will turn all the way around.
Good luck tomorrow!
--Dennis |
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| Greg323i |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 4:06am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 360
Melbourne, Australia
1982 Hennaröt 323i |
A way to get around the 30mm socket is to simply leave the car in first gear and with the brake off and the key off (very important!!  ) just nudge the front or rear of the car until the marks line up. This really should only be done on fairly level pavement. |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 7:25pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 13
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ok at what speed is a good one to check the timeing at??? also could you describe the balencer marks better... I have two bubbles, and they are so crudded up i cant see a label. I think they are the marks but not for sure. So please discribe your marks!!! Is it an acutal knotch, or a bubble? |
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| myersport |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 8:12pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
2200 rpm with the vacuum advance disconnected. Aim the light at the hole in the top of the bell housing at the back of the head, and adjust the dizzy until the timing mark (it's a BB on the flywheel) comes into view. If the mark seems to jump around ALOT at a steady engine speed, the bushings in the distributor my be worn out, causing misfiresdue to erroneous triggering.
--Dennis |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 8:28pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 14
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
Iedited my previous remark please read. Also im just trying a static timing to get it to run. Then when i find a timing gun today ill do the dynamic |
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| myersport |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 8:36pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
The mark on the front pully is a notch at the rear belt groove. You set static timing with the engine off.
--Dennis |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 8:40pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 15
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ty for your attempt to help this mech. disadvantaged humanbeing  ok i found the knotch and like yours there is only one!! my motor is so caked with crap that i could not see it... ok i have the static set, one quick question...should the rotor be right on the point on the number one chanber, or just before it? |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 6th 9:44pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 17
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
hehe edit again also, how can i tell if the roter is 180 out? The dizzy rotates all the way around!!
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| myersport |
Posted
Thursday, Jun 7th 12:18am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 184
east tennessee
'82 320iS. '91 327iC |
To be absolutely sure, remove the valve cover and check the timing mark on the camshaft. There is a notch that will line up with the center of the oiler rail when the engine is ultimately at TDC. At that point the rotor tip should be aligned with the notch on the dizzy body. When all this is set, the engine should start, barring any other problems elsewhere. Once it is warmed up, you set the dynamic timing as I described before.
--Dennis |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Thursday, Jun 7th 2:13am [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 19
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
ok ive done this and all the marks line up. No start any ideas? |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 20th 9:19pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 27
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
if fuse 3 was interupted would this effect the starting? not sure what it is for...all the wireing diagrams i have show it blank!!! i have found out that it is the auto choke. aslo i have the car running, and am currently trying to time it with a timeing gun. I can only see one mark through the bell housing and i set the dizzy to fire right on it. This still runs like its out of time... the mark looks like a pin stickin off the back of the fly wheel. it there other marks? im thinking so, but what should i look for? |
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| docctorwho |
Posted
Wednesday, Jun 20th 11:50pm [Edit] [Quote] [IMS] [View car] |
Member
Post nr. 28
east alton, il
1983 320i/4 m10 e21 |
sorry i edited my prev post. please reread it and advise... TY for your help
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